Is leaving the lights on at night in downtown Cleveland an attempt to show signs of life to the world good policy?

Submitted by Norm Roulet on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 14:45.
Absolutely essential if we are to be seen as vibrant and attractive to the world - people like bling
16% (7 votes)
If national TV cameras are rolling in the sky, for a major event attracting many eyes upon us, it makes sense
20% (9 votes)
I like seeing the lights and I'm sure others do too, but we are in a recession and must conserve - seems a bit dim
4% (2 votes)
I am committed to "Sustainable Cleveland 2019", however you define that, and that means unneeded lights out
13% (6 votes)
Wasting millions of MWHs of scarce, polluting, expensive power to attract high flying UFOs and/or CEOs is alien logic
47% (21 votes)
Total votes: 45
( categories: )

More on the issues related to this poll here...

Submitted by Norm Roulet on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 14:52.

REAL COOP member Jeff Buster raised some important questions that must be addressed, regarding "Cleveland Thermal vs Steelers - Lights on for what?", including

Anyone know why the lights at the corporate baseball diamond are on tonight?

Who pays the electric bill at the Jake?

In addition to discussion on this issue there, I posted this poll to collect REALNEO visitors' impressions on this matter - please participate fully, as we need answers to these questions, and it appears some changes to policy are due here in Cleveland, and we will best drive that from here on REALNEO.

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Ideally...

Submitted by robpitingolo on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 15:14.

Ideally, the lights would be on because many people live downtown and are home for the evening. Or because many businesses downtown are bustling with people. It's a shame we have to think about whether the lights should be on or not because most of the buildings downtown are completely emptied out by that time of evening. Then we wouldn't be trying to "be seen as vibrant and attractive to the world" - we just would be.

I voted the first option -

Submitted by noner on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 15:30.

AREn't we the Blue City on the Green Lake????

Black is Beautiful - Dark Skies All Night!

Submitted by Jeff Buster on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 17:56.

 

 
90 million tons of carbon dioxide are excreted into the world’s atmosphere every day. This pollution is called an “externality” in (terms of business costs) because there are not any meters on chimneys which charge the pollution dischargers a money cost – thus the costs of pollution are “external” to the individual business polluter.  
 
But the “cost” of the carbon dioxide, heavy metals, mining destruction, etc,  is not external to our lungs or our overall planet.   
 
We are paying in health deterioration and we are paying in ecosystem disruption.
 
So, if I were Mayor Jackson or Andrew Waterson or Joe Roman or Ronn Richard I would spin the darkened City this way:
 
During a major sporting or other event, when the national media was filming, I would script the Mayor’s office and County Commissioners to ask all local business to make sure that every unnecessary light was extinguished.
 
I would offer free bumper stickers broadcasting BLACK IS BEAUTIFUL
 
I would have the Mayor’s office arrange a “Global Warming – Do Your Share” press conference.   At the press conference Mayor Jackson would announce  that Cleveland may  be (is) a poor City, but Cleveland  was a responsible and smart City - and that Cleveland took it’s environmental stewardship responsibility very, very seriously – and so did all the businesses and occupants of Cleveland, and that is why the City is BLACKER than any other US City.   
 
Then, (with advance notice to the press corps who were in attendance at the conference) I would have the lights turned out and complete the television interview just with audio – in the dark.  
 
This use of a Blacked out interview would be carried on Jon Steward. Young people in Cleveland would get the impression that old fogies like the Mayor, Mr. Roman, and Mr. Richard were in fact pretty hip and with it.
 
Then, young people would feel comfortable in turning their lights off – cuz the old fogies even agree that it is main stream to go dark.  
 
CPP would shed base load and less coal would be burned.  
 
Spending less money on electricity, the young people would have more money for Great Lakes Christmas Ale ($10.99 per six pack – whew! – one six pack equates to saving about 109 KWH of electricity per month).
 
Great Lakes Brewery would hire more workers and Mayor Jackson would get more employment tax revenue.
 
The garbage tax could be suspended.
 
All Because Black is Beautiful!
 
That’s how it needs to be spun.   (its also the truth)
 
But none of our local political or enviro “leaders” have the gumption, conviction, or persuasive ability to stand up in front of a local or national audience and tell it like it is.   And dirty coal lobby money helps keep it that way.
 
 

 

dirty coal lobby money helps keep it that way

Submitted by Norm Roulet on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 18:19.

Not just the lobby, but the mine owners and shippers based right here in NEO.

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Candles

Submitted by lmcshane on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 20:42.

Are much more romantic and kill less birds :)  Turning off the lights in buildings will prevent night migration collisions. 

REAL COOP investigative challenge... Who Owns Cleveland Thermal

Submitted by Norm Roulet on Fri, 12/11/2009 - 18:32.

Jeff Buster and I are concerned about the pollution from Cleveland Thermal.

I have researched the ownership, management and leadership and have found nothing but po boxes, black ops, a donation to Cimperman for Congress, and a collaboration with GCBL to expand generating capacity... a few lost souls fronting for some big money people dodging environmental justice... but who exactly are the real winners (the few primary stockholders)?

Consider this a REAL COOP investigative challenge... Who Owns Cleveland Thermal?

Let me know if you may track down anything helpful... post it here!

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Building lights kill many more birds than wind turbines

Submitted by Lee Batdorff on Sat, 12/12/2009 - 14:31.

A few years ago, after a presentation on wind turbines at Entreprenuers for Sustainability I went over to David Beach (now operating Green City Blue Lake Institute) and asked "what about the birds?"

He sent me several Web links to research on this.

The research showed that lights on in tall buildings at night kill far more birds than wind turbines.

I wonder if birds are piling up under the lights at Progressive Field and they sweep them up every morning before the public can see them.